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Post by SW O on May 20, 2024 9:14:04 GMT
Good to see that there isn't a single comment - money doesn't talk.
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2024 9:48:00 GMT
Huh?
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Post by SW O on May 20, 2024 10:04:08 GMT
Trying and failing to be succint: what I meant is that no one here cares - and to a large extent because you only succeed in the Premier League if you have vast amounts of money. The only interesting thing to me is that the three teams that were promoted last season all went straight back down because they weren't big spenders. |
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Post by Thor on May 20, 2024 10:53:11 GMT
I didn't see any of it as my kids team had an afternoon kick off. On my way home I had talksport on and they switch to West Ham who have scored which would have put added pressure on City, fans are going wild then VAR steps in and ruins the atmosphere, the stage show is now wrecked.
Then we go to Arsenal same thing and the ref over rules VAR que the fans going mental.
I've not seen either decision so can't provide an opinion on it other than what I believe is that VAR is spoiling football. My youngest son made a point that VAR is better and quicker in the Champions League. Are they doing something different?
Still I would love to see the O's in that division before I leave this mortal coil.
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Post by dohnut on May 20, 2024 11:52:27 GMT
I always believe it’s best to get things right. VAR increases the chances of that. As for delays, on average the ball is in play less than an hour in a game. The rest is delays. An age to take a free kick or throw, tactical substitutions to slow the game down, fake injuries, drinks, game management. Even managers on the side line trying to slow things down Endless ways to waste time. But hey, let’s blame VAR.
Plenty that the game could do to end this waste of time and increase actual playing time, but of course they don’t.
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2024 11:54:02 GMT
Trying and failing to be succint: what I meant is that no one here cares - and to a large extent because you only succeed in the Premier League if you have vast amounts of money. The only interesting thing to me is that the three teams that were promoted last season all went straight back down because they weren't big spenders. Ah right. Yeah, I guess I'd like a team other than Man City to win it but otherwise I'm pretty much done with elite club football. I can only remember watching one PL game this season.
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Post by kbola on May 20, 2024 14:54:53 GMT
Good to see that there isn't a single comment - money doesn't talk. Well there wasn't until you created a thread about it 🤔😄 |
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Post by blip the thrOttle on May 20, 2024 15:52:24 GMT
I always believe it’s best to get things right. VAR increases the chances of that. As for delays, on average the ball is in play less than an hour in a game. The rest is delays. An age to take a free kick or throw, tactical substitutions to slow the game down, fake injuries, drinks, game management. Even managers on the side line trying to slow things down Endless ways to waste time. But hey, let’s blame VAR. Plenty that the game could do to end this waste of time and increase actual playing time, but of course they don’t. I don't thinks its about time wasting,I think it's more to do with being able to spontaneously celebrate a goal which tbf is ruined by VAR. |
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Post by dohnut on May 20, 2024 20:05:58 GMT
I always believe it’s best to get things right. VAR increases the chances of that. As for delays, on average the ball is in play less than an hour in a game. The rest is delays. An age to take a free kick or throw, tactical substitutions to slow the game down, fake injuries, drinks, game management. Even managers on the side line trying to slow things down Endless ways to waste time. But hey, let’s blame VAR. Plenty that the game could do to end this waste of time and increase actual playing time, but of course they don’t. I don't thinks its about time wasting,I think it's more to do with being able to spontaneously celebrate a goal which tbf is ruined by VAR. Or spontaneous indignation and upset when a mistake has been identified. Swings and roundabouts. Goals are spontaneously cheered, VAR doesn’t change that, provide one example! A period of nervous review will be followed by more spontaneous cheering from one side of the other. Same as penalty kicks after the wait. VAR is about getting things right. The issue is not VAR but the over-reliance on the system. But consider this, if officials don’t use VAR but it’s later found out they got it wrong, the headlines slaughter the officials for not using it. If VAR is stopped, the first time a mistake is identified, the officials will be slaughtered. Officials are onto a hiding to nothing with or without VAR. Plenty of evidence at Brisbane Road this season of that. Said it before, us fans just want to moan (as do club management) no matter what. It’s what we do. Looking at the stats VAR is not as frequent as we believe, it just makes the headlines often. |
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Post by Thor on May 20, 2024 21:27:18 GMT
How about this decision dohnut? Happy with it?
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Post by Thor on May 20, 2024 21:31:56 GMT
A players viewpoint.
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Post by dohnut on May 20, 2024 22:01:44 GMT
For a players viewpoint maybe one players viewpoint. this sort of stuff gets rolled out. If things don’t go their way they look for blame. Had a penalty been given the opposition would be saying the same thing about VAR. Never can please both sides. Players saying it’s ok if the referee makes a mistake. Please spare me, that’s not the norm and we all know it. In the EFL with no VAR it’s always the officials, listen to Evans, he have a field day with VAR. Listen to RW, listen to many post match comments, cant even get the right number of minutes added on. Let’s blame the clock! Human nature. Have to take this stuff with a pinch of salt. Two games going on, the football game and the blame game. That will never change from the Premiership downwards. I listened to the wolves manager after his “ worst decision he ever seen” comment. Have a listen, even he said the decision not to award the goal may have been right within the laws of the game, if so the laws need looking at. So VAR was right! His own admission. A team nearly wrongly denied 3 points but for VAR. The criticises the referee despite accepting he applied the laws of the game. ! I find it amazing that he moans at VAR despite acknowledging it was probably right. Referees enforce the laws as they are, not how people think they should be. And he is a premier manager, Could the use of VAR be improved? Of course. But wait and see the fallout if it is scrapped. The TV pundits and fans will have other stuff to moan about and referees will continue to get crucified as they did regularly before VAR. |
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Post by Thor on May 20, 2024 22:23:21 GMT
Can you post up the wolves incident you refer to please?
Today I spoke to a guy who works for me, he goes home and away all over following Arsenal. I said to him today what does he think about var in the premier v var in the champions league. He said the CL is far superior to the PL, I asked him why and he said he don’t know, but it’s far quicker, the decisions are slicker and there less arguments. He doesn’t know why that it, but it just is. He went on to say of they brought it to the PL then most arguments would go away.
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Post by dohnut on May 21, 2024 4:12:04 GMT
Can you post up the wolves incident you refer to please? Today I spoke to a guy who works for me, he goes home and away all over following Arsenal. I said to him today what does he think about var in the premier v var in the champions league. He said the CL is far superior to the PL, I asked him why and he said he don’t know, but it’s far quicker, the decisions are slicker and there less arguments. He doesn’t know why that it, but it just is. He went on to say of they brought it to the PL then most arguments would go away. I’ll have to work out how to add a YouTube clip! But I will because this is an excellent example of the issues in football. A game of fine margins and this one is exactly that. |
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Post by dohnut on May 21, 2024 4:18:31 GMT
The comments from the young lady are wrong. Obstruction is exactly that and just because a player can move around the opponent doesn’t change that. It is also irrelevant as to whether the keeper could have saved to header or not. A comment Gary ONeil has also made. This comment is so wrong. An offence has been committed, it’s not a let’s play advantage situation, what happens after the offence makes no odds. Open up a can of worms if referees have to judge whether the keeper could or couldn’t make a save. That a prem manager makes that comment, different clip, is astounding. Loads of clips on Gary O’Neil and var.
When you scour comments on this many pundits like Gary Lineker are critical of the decision. But the conclusion is that the referee has applied the law as it currently stands. He cannot do anything else. Change the law? Perhaps. But that too is irrelevant.
VAR ensured the correct result in my opinion. I do expect referees to have discretion at times based on the game, common sense so to speak, but in this case the decision is pretty clear and no discretion is possible, and O’Neil has changed his stance to a degree from his immediate post game comment.
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Post by Thor on May 21, 2024 5:03:31 GMT
Thanks.
That’s the first time I’ve seen that goal. Looking at it, the keepers line of sight is obscured, the player is directly in front of him this denying him the ability to move in a forwards motion, thereby impeding his direct movement. Yes he is also in an offside position. The correct decision was awarded.
However, I do see what the manager was saying. I don’t think the law needs changing at all in those circumstances just being applied in a more consistent manner. Likewise with holding at corners it goes on all the time with players runs impeaded, but time and again nothing happens, the law needs to be followed and it’s that lack of consistency which riles up everyone.
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Post by ramblingman on May 21, 2024 6:47:20 GMT
Two thoughts;
1. If football was about sport, Monday's headlines would have been about Crawley. "Richest team with best players does the expected", is not a headline in my book.
2. VAR is a tool for TV watchers, not for stadium spectators. It also helps minimise the role of luck in determining results and thus benefits the bigger teams- which is why the Prem will vote to keep it and why the EFL should resist it.
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Post by dohnut on May 21, 2024 8:14:05 GMT
Thanks. That’s the first time I’ve seen that goal. Looking at it, the keepers line of sight is obscured, the player is directly in front of him this denying him the ability to move in a forwards motion, thereby impeding his direct movement. Yes he is also in an offside position. The correct decision was awarded. However, I do see what the manager was saying. I don’t think the law needs changing at all in those circumstances just being applied in a more consistent manner. Likewise with holding at corners it goes on all the time with players runs impeaded, but time and again nothing happens, the law needs to be followed and it’s that lack of consistency which riles up everyone. Agree about consistency or lack of. Referees need some scope to judge, not all games are the same and not all situations are the same. I don’t believe it’s always easy to compare two similar incidents equally because context can be different. Time wasting at 5-0 is different to time wasting at 1-0 perhaps. But even accepting that, which I do, inconsistency remains. Some referees allow stolen yards on throws/kicks whilst others are pedantic. Some allow fast free kicks from the wrong place, others are pedantic. But us fans are inconsistent too, we accept things when 1-0 up that infuriate when 1-0 down. Sometimes it suits to have quick free kick even from the wrong place but get angry when opponents do the same. Context. That will never change. Managers too are inconsistent, I’ve listened to a few of O’Neil’s VAR rants and he too is inconsistent. And he is wrong to question the knowledge and experience of a referee when he too is proven to be wrong. Passion breeds inconsistency of comment. Referees may not have ever played the game at top level, but managers have never refereed a game at top level either. So who is he to say what he did! But referees need to be consistent and some of this stuff is so easy to fix. Even if sometimes it annoys fans and managers. |
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Post by dohnut on May 21, 2024 8:21:43 GMT
Two thoughts; 1. If football was about sport, Monday's headlines would have been about Crawley. "Richest team with best players does the expected", is not a headline in my book. 2. VAR is a tool for TV watchers, not for stadium spectators. It also helps minimise the role of luck in determining results and thus benefits the bigger teams- which is why the Prem will vote to keep it and why the EFL should resist it. Var is about getting decisions as right as you can. Every var decision is reviewed post game. Of course mistakes may still be made but that’s life, it’s not perfect and never will be. I don’t believe for one second the size of the team is important. In fact I’d suggest it’s an aid to a referee who has 50,000 fans trying to influence what he does. |
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Post by SW O on May 21, 2024 8:49:00 GMT
If football was about sport, Monday's headlines would have been about Crawley. "Richest team with best players does the expected", is not a headline in my book. Spot on! |
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