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Post by disoriented on Oct 4, 2020 7:19:34 GMT
Joins Aldershot on loan.
WTF.
It is clear the club do not value our talented youth, especially if they have no relatives in the front office.
The kid deserved to have a breakout season with us.
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Post by redintheface on Oct 4, 2020 7:36:05 GMT
Joins Aldershot on loan. WTF. It is clear the club do not value our talented youth, especially if they have no relatives in the front office. The kid deserved to have a breakout season with us. I don’t know that Ogie “ deserved to have a breakout season with us” as you put it but he certainly deserved to be given the chance ! I assume that this move to Aldershot is only a short term deal initially ? Maybe it has something to do with the incoming defender(s) that RE mentioned in his interview ? Would certainly be a strange one if it doesn’t 😐
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2020 7:56:06 GMT
Sadly, there is only space for 11 players on the pitch at any one time. Ogie badly needs minutes, ideally a run of games, and he can't get them with us at the moment. There's no reason to think he won't have a future with us, but he's only 18 so it's just not right now.
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Post by howlingmad on Oct 4, 2020 8:04:39 GMT
especially if they have no relatives in the front office. Eh?
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Post by redshank on Oct 4, 2020 9:44:39 GMT
Joins Aldershot on loan. WTF. It is clear the club do not value our talented youth, especially if they have no relatives in the front office. The kid deserved to have a breakout season with us. The loan period in the National League will get our youngster match fit and match ready.He may come back as a complete player. Even the best players go out on loan.Look at the loans we have had that have had great futures with their clubs and England. Well done those in the back office for running our football club in the way they think best,and what is the best way forward for all concerned.
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Post by redintheface on Oct 4, 2020 10:08:22 GMT
Sadly, there is only space for 11 players on the pitch at any one time. Ogie badly needs minutes, ideally a run of games, and he can't get them with us at the moment. There's no reason to think he won't have a future with us, but he's only 18 so it's just not right now. I take your point volcano but Ogie ( who is actually 19 now) is a big, strapping boy who should have no issue with the physical demands of League 2 football. So what is it about his game that RE thinks is such a problem that he couldn’t be given a chance at a time when we are playing arguably our most potent attacking threat at LB and Widdowson ( imho) is not up to scratch at the position? There are numerous past examples of the O’s putting players who were a good bit younger onto the field as defenders - Paul Went (15), Tommy Taylor (16), Paul Harris ( 17), Colin Foster (17) , Adrian Whitbread(18) to name a few! It’s an old adage that “ if you’re good enough, you’re old enough” and guys like Ogie IF they are good enough should be forcing their way into contention about now I think.👍
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2020 10:50:47 GMT
Sadly, there is only space for 11 players on the pitch at any one time. Ogie badly needs minutes, ideally a run of games, and he can't get them with us at the moment. There's no reason to think he won't have a future with us, but he's only 18 so it's just not right now. I take your point volcano but Ogie ( who is actually 19 now) is a big, strapping boy who should have no issue with the physical demands of League 2 football. So what is it about his game that RE thinks is such a problem that he couldn’t be given a chance at a time when we are playing arguably our most potent attacking threat at LB and Widdowson ( imho) is not up to scratch at the position? There are numerous past examples of the O’s putting players who were a good bit younger onto the field as defenders - Paul Went (15), Tommy Taylor (16), Paul Harris ( 17), Colin Foster (17) , Adrian Whitbread(18) to name a few! It’s an old adage that “ if you’re good enough, you’re old enough” and guys like Ogie IF they are good enough should be forcing their way into contention about now I think.👍 Ogie is a big guy but still a bit raw (IMO), in the sense that he seems to me a bit wayward at times. Just needs some more games. As to what we used to do, chucking youngsters in on the "good enough, old enough principle, I actually agree entirely. But the way things are now, with the pressures we as fans put on managers and players, and the ability we have these days to play back and criticise every slight misjudgment ad infinitum, I can see why Ross & Co want to wait a bit. However, thankfully it does look like we're about to strengthen at the back and it will be interesting to see what happens. I imagine we'll see a youngster in on loan from somewhere like Tottenham.
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Post by redintheface on Oct 4, 2020 11:18:47 GMT
I take your point volcano but Ogie ( who is actually 19 now) is a big, strapping boy who should have no issue with the physical demands of League 2 football. So what is it about his game that RE thinks is such a problem that he couldn’t be given a chance at a time when we are playing arguably our most potent attacking threat at LB and Widdowson ( imho) is not up to scratch at the position? There are numerous past examples of the O’s putting players who were a good bit younger onto the field as defenders - Paul Went (15), Tommy Taylor (16), Paul Harris ( 17), Colin Foster (17) , Adrian Whitbread(18) to name a few! It’s an old adage that “ if you’re good enough, you’re old enough” and guys like Ogie IF they are good enough should be forcing their way into contention about now I think.👍 Ogie is a big guy but still a bit raw (IMO), in the sense that he seems to me a bit wayward at times. Just needs some more games. As to what we used to do, chucking youngsters in on the "good enough, old enough principle, I actually agree entirely. But the way things are now, with the pressures we as fans put on managers and players, and the ability we have these days to play back and criticise every slight misjudgment ad infinitum, I can see why Ross & Co want to wait a bit. However, thankfully it does look like we're about to strengthen at the back and it will be interesting to see what happens. I imagine we'll see a youngster in on loan from somewhere like Tottenham. Yes, I’m sure Ogie is lacking in experience and maybe that is the reason behind RE’s reluctance to try him out and instead to send him out on loan to Aldershot. Although I might well be wrong, personally that leaves me with the impression that Embleton & co have doubts about his ability. As you say, it looks as though a defender -or even two - may well brought in over the next 48 hours so I guess it’s only fair to wait and see how that pans out before sitting in judgement!
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Post by dohnut on Oct 4, 2020 11:26:08 GMT
Ogie is a big guy but still a bit raw (IMO), in the sense that he seems to me a bit wayward at times. Just needs some more games. As to what we used to do, chucking youngsters in on the "good enough, old enough principle, I actually agree entirely. But the way things are now, with the pressures we as fans put on managers and players, and the ability we have these days to play back and criticise every slight misjudgment ad infinitum, I can see why Ross & Co want to wait a bit. However, thankfully it does look like we're about to strengthen at the back and it will be interesting to see what happens. I imagine we'll see a youngster in on loan from somewhere like Tottenham. Yes, I’m sure Ogie is lacking in experience and maybe that is the reason behind RE’s reluctance to try him out and instead to send him out on loan to Aldershot. Although I might well be wrong, personally that leaves me with the impression that Embleton & co have doubts about his ability. As you say, it looks as though a defender -or even two - may well brought in over the next 48 hours so I guess it’s only fair to wait and see how that pans out before sitting in judgement! Not too sure Spurs had doubts about Kane’s ability when he was loaned to us. The chance to get game time an develop. Not too much wrong with that. He will come back all the better for it I’m sure.
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Post by redintheface on Oct 4, 2020 11:33:23 GMT
You’re equating Shadrach Ogie to Harry Kane? Come on mate you can do better that that!😄
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Post by redshank on Oct 4, 2020 11:41:48 GMT
You’re equating Shadrach Ogie to Harry Kane? Come on mate you can do better that that!😄 I think the point is Harry Kane was helped on his way to the top by being on loan to a lower league club to get him used to league football.Let it be with Ogie,learn the rigours of regular league football. Must sayOgie says he has pace and seems very strong just what we need,we look weak in the tackle and have little pace when it is needed. Of course there are on loan players from better clubs who have not made it at the top level.Sam Bartram was one,Ryan Jarvis was another.I do believe I saw Ryan playing for Kings Lynn in the national league last evening on Bt Sport.
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Post by redintheface on Oct 4, 2020 11:57:41 GMT
You’re equating Shadrach Ogie to Harry Kane? Come on mate you can do better that that!😄 I think the point is Harry Kane was helped on his way to the top by being on loan to a lower league club to get him used to league football.Let it be with Ogie,learn the rigours of regular league football. Must sayOgie says he has pace and seems very strong just what we need,we look weak in the tackle and have little pace when it is needed. Of course there are on loan players from better clubs who have not made it at the top level.Sam Bartram was one,Ryan Jarvis was another.I do believe I saw Ryan playing for Kings Lynn in the national league last evening on Bt Sport. Yes I do get the point but in fairness Harry Kane was 17 when he was on loan at the O’s, and dropped two divisions to come here. In addition - if my memory serves me right - he spent a great deal of his time on the bench, frequently coming on in the last 30 minutes or so for 36 year old Scott McGleish! Ogie at 19 and with his physique should have no difficulty in adapting to the hurly burly of football at league two level - which let’s face it is not really a huge step up from National League in the vast majority of cases. I agree with you that his main assets of speed and strength in the tackle are something that defensively we could benefit from and it surprises me somewhat that RE appears reluctant to give him an opportunity. Maybe the defensive additions that were alluded to in the post match interview given by Ross will be better options - let’s wait and see👍
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Post by redshank on Oct 4, 2020 12:16:07 GMT
Around me,many were saying that Kane was rubbish when he did get on.A tad unfair for a youngster. A lot of our young players were ruined by coming on when we were losing 2 or three nil.Frightened to play because of the crowds reaction.I do know a young player who played for the O's,that is what he told me.Used to try and get away from the touchline.He never made it as a pro,just gave up.
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Post by dohnut on Oct 4, 2020 14:43:01 GMT
You’re equating Shadrach Ogie to Harry Kane? Come on mate you can do better that that!😄 Not the players, the principle that sending out a player on loan don’t mean doubts about his ability at his appropriate level. Just giving them game time to develop.
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Post by northeasto on Oct 4, 2020 15:06:24 GMT
You’re equating Shadrach Ogie to Harry Kane? Come on mate you can do better that that!😄 Not the players, the principle that sending out a player on loan don’t mean doubts about his ability at his appropriate level. Just giving them game time to develop. I agree. Sending him out on loan can be interpreted as RE having confidence in his ability to be a regular starter for us in the near future. I would also respectfully disagree with Redintheface’s comment that there is not much of a difference between National League and League 2. For instance Cheltenham yesterday were head and shoulders above an average NL side
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Post by osoldest on Oct 4, 2020 16:01:32 GMT
Ogie is a terrific prospect, he is an excellent tackler and has pace to spare. He should be playing for us now. My ideal full back pairing is ogie and turley, two proper full backs who can tackle and burst forward at pace.
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Post by redintheface on Oct 4, 2020 17:11:11 GMT
Not the players, the principle that sending out a player on loan don’t mean doubts about his ability at his appropriate level. Just giving them game time to develop. I agree. Sending him out on loan can be interpreted as RE having confidence in his ability to be a regular starter for us in the near future. I would also respectfully disagree with Redintheface’s comment that there is not much of a difference between National League and League 2. For instance Cheltenham yesterday were head and shoulders above an average NL side Just to point out my comment on the NL standard as opposed to League 2 -which I stand by - was qualified by the words “ in the vast majority of cases”. I fully accept that on Saturday’s showing , Cheltenham were an exception to that..
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Post by Timmo on Oct 5, 2020 4:39:05 GMT
We may have a player or two coming in this week, if that is the case it makes sense to loan out one or two as well. There are hundreds of young players out on loan all over the football pyramid why would we be any different.
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Post by disoriented on Oct 5, 2020 5:16:20 GMT
We may have a player or two coming in this week, if that is the case it makes sense to loan out one or two as well. There are hundreds of young players out on loan all over the football pyramid why would we be any different. Why when we have a star in the making of our own? Madness.
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Post by Timmo on Oct 5, 2020 7:45:04 GMT
I disagree and so do the club, so there! Seriously though I think it will do him good and may just be the final little push he needs. A bit like Ruel who came back full of confidence and made an impact on his return. Let's hope he is a star in the making.
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